The Flesh of The Sea is a horror-queer romance-adventure novella I wrote together with the lovely Shelley Lavigne. It follows Wilford Bowen as he tries to prove himself to the Royal Academy of London, and his dearest Jean-Baptiste, and in the process gets involved with a crew of pirates and bizarre creatures. With the release practically upon us (July 11th!) we decided to chat about writing the book, our visions for a potential adaptation, and what a possible sequel could involve.
LOR: Originally I was going to write this alone, but you were so excited and passionate about it from me pitching you the concept, it felt only natural to ask. How do you feel about our co-writing process? How does it differ from your solo work?
SHELLEY: I really enjoyed our planning sessions! It was fun (and helpful) to bounce ideas off of each other when we got stuck, and to “yes, and” each other’s ideas to wetter, goopier depths. I also really loved nerding out about stories and craft and characters together. Sometimes when I’m stuck and working on solo stuff, I’ll chat with friends about it, but no one gets your work as much as someone you’re working with, so it was a privilege to have you to talk to about it, honestly.
In terms of how it differs from my solo work, we did more planning and upfront character creation than I usually do. I mean, I do usually outline and have a pretty good idea of characters but because we were writing separately and had such a huge cast, we had to be on the same page so we went really in depth. I also think that having someone curb my over-writing was really useful, I am usually stuck expunging all my additional verbiage at the end all by my lonesome.
SHELLEY: What about you? And is there anything about the co-working process that you enjoyed or surprised you? And who would you collab with if you were given a chance to?
LOR: Honestly, I think it made me more accountable – because we would write bits and then “swap” and go over it, editing basically every step of the way. I loved how we got to the point where we couldn’t tell who wrote what!! You’re much more organized than me, which I have tried to implement in my own writing and planning.
As for who I’d like to collab with… I’d love to make a monster manual for a fake world, and work with an artist for the illustrations. But I love so many artists that it’s hard to pick one!!
SHELLEY: If this becomes a series, we should look into getting one of these made for the books. I’d love to see even more illustrations than we have in the novella (although gotta say La Mantia did an absolutely incredible job)
SHELLEY: Talking more about process, in what ways do you find that this novella resembles your other work? Differs from it?
LOR: Although I’m known as “the goop guy” I seem to always add worms to my stories, and there is a big boy in here! There are way more characters than I usually work with, generally I have just a handful, but we have two full pirate crews and various other folks that pop in. It was a lot to keep track of.
LOR: I know, at least for me – my initial image of Wilford as a character was pretty strong, and the others I had to “learn about” along the way. Especially folks like Barlow. Did any of them start one way and end another? Who, if any, is your fave?
SHELLEY: I think Wilford and his motivations and personality were extremely clear from the get-go. You wrote that sample paragraph and I knew *immediately* who he was, how he held himself, how he saw the world around him. I think Jean Baptiste took a little bit more time to get to know, but I also feel like this suits their characters. Wilford is so outgoing and JB is a lot more reserved, anxious, careful. Regardless, by the end, I loved him just as much as I did Wil. I also like our supporting cast! On each read through, I’ve found a new favourite. It’s such a huge cast, something I’d never ever done before, and it’s fun to see how different all the characters are and how they work together.
SHELLEY: Which of the characters grew on you the most? Who did you want to spend more time with?
LOR: We don’t get much of Captain Samson, but I’m a sucker for an old man with a gruff but kind demeanour. There’s a scene with him and Wil that I’m very proud of, sort of “I don’t really know how to talk about my feelings, but I’m trying” kinda vibe. I’m a bit shy around new people, but I’d be down to watch Barlow practising swordsmanship…Those GUNS!!!
SHELLEY: I really love the expansion we did on his character, giving him more meat HAHA
LOR: Are you a Sea Goddess Simp or a Tear Gang Truther? 😉
SHELLEY: I feel like the Goddess matches my energy and I’d likely do better under her command/on her ship but I aspire to the steadiness of the Tear. If that makes sense.
SHELLEY: What about you? Team Goddess or Team Tear? Also we have got to make merch of this a la Twilight
LOR: Oh I’m absolutely down bad for the Goddess. No question. And yes, let’s make merch!!!
(Lor: I whipped these together cuz I’m just obsessed with this idea.)
LOR: What is your favourite chapter? Fave line? (spoilers potentially)
SHELLEY: I bet you think you know what this was going to be, but honestly I loved the little teasing jabs. It’s a big way I demonstrate my love, it’s saying “I know you well enough to notice your foibles, and they make me love you even more.” I think some of that comes through in this.
The crew is hilarious and despite being (or maybe because they are) in a lot of tricky situations, humour is both a way to bond and to relieve tension. Mac especially. He has a couple lines that still make me laugh out loud.
There’s also a really great wistful JB line that’s really stuck with me, but I won’t state exactly what because it’s a bit of a spoiler, but it has to do with wind and sails.
SHELLEY: I’m really curious about your fave chapter/line!
LOR: I never get tired of Wil discovering some new, horrifying creature and completely oblivious to danger, just excited to check out a new bug or whatever. His curiosity is delightful. I also like a bit at the very end of the book, a simple, short line – but I won’t spoil 😉
SHELLEY: Wilford is on a mission to gather some scientific samples to bring back with him to England and gain entrance into the Royal Society. Which of the many beasts he encounters would you want to try to catch to bring home? And why?
LOR: This might be a lame answer, but the plant. I’m sure they could find some scientific use for it, and bonus that it’s not a sentient being, so I wouldn’t feel terrible about it being in captivity.
LOR: We’ve both mentioned a POTENTIAL sequel. Dream scenario: what critter would you want to show up?
SHELLEY: That’s so incredibly easy, I would love to do more deep sea stuff, and I have some pretty cool ship ideas already brewing. We need to have an angler fish, that’s kinda non-negotiable at this point.
SHELLEY: Any specific ones you’d want to have included so we can make sure to get it into the contract?
LOR: I remember we discussed fungi (you’re the fun-guy in this duo!) but we couldn’t nail down an idea for them. That’d be nice to explore! Or a moving island, like a giant turtle. I know that’s a cliché, but they’re so cool.
LOR: if this was a movie/show, who would star as our boys? Who’d direct?
SHELLEY: Aiming really high on this one, but I really think it would be Guillermo del Toro’s cup of tea. I think the glee with every new monster discovery (and obviously the monster design) would really resonate with him. I also think he’d do a great job with the more romantic aspects of the book.
We’ve joked about this, but Micheal Sheen and David Tennant would work. I’m pretty terrible at casting characters, though.
SHELLEY:You’re probably way better at this than me, what do you think?
LOR: It’s hard not to echo GDT, because we are just such huge fanboys. I don’t have a director in mind, but I recently watched a film called Vesper, and it had this lovely low-key approach to a post apoc/sci-fi setting with lots of nature and weird creatures interacting with humans. Maybe someone unknown, striking out with a wild debut? Get weird with it.
Actually, Jesse Plemons might make a good Wilford. I just like that guy!
It’s funny how influenced I was by Good Omens, subconsciously. I didn’t even think about it until you mentioned it and then had an “oh shit” moment. There’s definitely some Laios from Dungeon Meshi in there too, just hyperfocused on monsters.
(Lor: Both Bloodborne and Dredge were influential while writing The Flesh of The Sea!)
SHELLEY: You’re a huge video game fan, have you given any thought to this being adapted into a game? Who might be best placed to do so?
LOR: I actually HADN’T considered it becoming a game, but if I did… I could see it as a visual novel, like Telltale Games’ The Walking Dead series. Or a spin on Disco Elysium, which has a lot of fun dialogue choices and a really detailed world. Either way, it would need to have voice acting, absolutely.
The Flesh of The Sea is up for preorder now (paperback version coming soon) – and drops July 11th!
LORMAGGOT 